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Garrett: Awesome. So yeah, thanks Adam for coming on the podcast. If you don’t mind sharing more about your background and role at Turo, that’d be awesome.

Adam: Yeah, so my name is Adam Miller. I’m the director of user acquisition at Turo.  you know, my background is primarily in the agency world. I’ve spent over 10 years in the agency world,  originally specializing in healthcare and then slowly but surely, I moved into the travel space, really started specializing in mobile, maybe only about five or six years ago.  At the time, I mean, it was really coming up. It was apparent that, you know, mobile user acquisition was going to become a thing and all that it means today. It’s crazy how much it’s grown in just those few years but Turo is just been an amazing company. I saw Andre Haddad our CEO speak at one time and, was really just taken with the concept. For those of you who don’t know, Turo is the world’s largest car sharing marketplace, primarily operating in the United States, Canada, the UK, and Germany.

Garrett: Awesome. Yeah. So it’s Kinda like an Airbnb for cars. Right?

Adam: Exactly. I think that’s probably the easiest way to describe it.

Garrett: Awesome. So just jumping into questions, if you don’t mind sharing some of the top channels you run on, whether that be native, social, search, ad networks, programmatic, things like that.

Adam: Yeah. So today I would say a lot of our UA efforts are really focused on paid social and search.  I don’t think that’s gonna come as any surprise for a lot of people. Where we probably differentiate  ourselves, from a lot of other advertisers out there is, we have a lot of great relationships with like online travel agencies. That’s something that is unique to travel, but then we certainly try to push ourselves even outside of that,  simply because Turo has really two sides of the marketplace. Right? There is the side that we consider to be demand, which are those who come to us and they obviously want to book a car from us and then there’s the, the supply side that’s filled with a thousands of hosts around the world who list their cars on Turo for others to book. So I would say we tend to, we tend to specialize more on the host acquisition side via paid social. Whereas the demand side, there’s a lot of in market demand already and it’s really just about us capturing that in market demand from search in OTAs.

Casey: Got It are you able to talk about how you partner with some of these travel companies?  On the paid side?

Adam: Yeah. So if you think about your typical experience, whenever you go to a Kayak, you go to an Expedia, you tend to see what I would consider to be more commoditized listings and so we really try to stand out in that environment a lot of these providers are really,  competing on price more than anything else. If you also think about the categorization that they have, it’s like intermediate, subcompact, full size, that kind of thing. The truth is that definition can vary from car rental agency to car rental agency and so one of the easiest ways that we really differentiate ourselves is actually by going to market with a really funny tagline, but it’s a very useful tagline – “It’s way better than a rental car”, and that really is our differentiating point because when a lot of users see that, and that is also one of our best performing copies, when a lot of users see that they understand that this is something similar but not really the same. You know, we are a car sharing marketplace and in many ways we are different from car rental.

Garrett. Got It. Yeah, I mean I would, I think it seems more interesting to rent a car that someone has before and  you know, rather than just going to a Hertz or something like that. So,

Casey: Yeah, I used Turo back in December for a trip in Colorado and it was really nice.

Adam: How’d it go?

Casey: Went well,  I’m a repeat user.

Adam: What car did you get?

Casey:  An SUV

Adam: What kind?

Casey: I don’t remember.

Adam: You don’t remember the make and model?

Casey: Oh, and you know what? It was some kind of Toyota, Toyota hybrid four by four.

Adam: Wow

Casey: Car, for the mountains.

Adam: Very nice. Ski Trip?

Casey: Ski Trip. Yep.

Adam: Okay that does not surprise me.

Garrett: Are the prices on Turo are the prices kind of cheaper on Turo as compared to like a Hertz or rent-a-car place?

Adam: Yeah, on average, our marketplace is about 30% to 35% less expensive than a traditional car rental agency. Where you’re going to get the most bang for your buck is typically at the higher end of that spectrum. So if you think about sports cars the one comparison that I always use is a, I’ve seen an Audi R8 in the wild for up to $1,200 a day. You can typically get an Audi R8 on Turo for hundreds of dollars a day. So it depends on market or market, but that just gives you an idea of the, the price discrepancy. Also typically minivans, those are another area where we really shine.

Garrett: Interesting. Very cool, and do you guys do anything to target users that specifically want to rent minivans or higher end cars?

Adam: So we do have a segmentation internally and really it, I would say it’s a lot more basic than that. Really where it looks at is where you’re coming from and where you want to go.  If you think about that, it’s really about point of origin and destination. We do a lot to really build these international network effects amongst our different user bases. If you think about the situation where there’s somebody in London who is searching for a car in Los Angeles, we can absolutely take that customer, activate them in Los Angeles, but then whenever they go back to the UK, there’s a real opportunity there to promote repeat travel.  So we tend to think about it on both the macro level and the micro level.

Garrett: Got it. And  how do you guys target, how do you guys think about kind of geo-targeting and, you know, trying to figure out how to target users when their traveling to a certain place?  How do you kind of find when they have that intent?

Adam: Yeah in market intent for travel companies, there’s really two peak periods, right? One is May through September, right? So it’s typically what you might think of a summer travel season. And then there’s the end of the year travel season and that’s usually November and December when a lot of people are traveling for the holidays. W e do tend to, I would say throttle our acquisition efforts throughout the year depending on what season it is. You know, for a low season, maybe we will acquire a little bit less supply but right now, I mean, it’s full throttle mode. I mean, really we’re about to ramp into the summer travel season and that is by far one of our most important seasons.

C: And do you guys use any type of third party data or first party data to do targeting?

Adam: Yeah, that’s a great question. We do, so we, we have partnered with some other companies, especially on car ownership data that’s very valuable data to us. As you can imagine. I think one of the hardest things about,  supply acquisition in general is just qualifying whether or not somebody owns a vehicle to even list on Turo in the first place. If you think about going out to the masses, you know, you think about your mass media like TV and billboards and even radio to a lesser extent there’s really no qualification there, right? There’s not that much data. Certainly could look at census data, vehicle ownership data, but it’s really tough for me to talk one to one to the average vehicle owner and let them know that you can offset the cost of this vehicle by simply listing it and booking it out for even only a few days per month.

Garrett: Hmm and what’s the, what’s the average amount a renter makes on Turo?

Adam: Oh, so that, that is actually a great question. And it really depends on the vehicle and it depends on your market. The good news is we have a new tool for that. It’s called the car-culator. If you go to turo.com/carculator you can actually look up the exact year, make, model that you currently own, as well as your market, and we will give you an estimate in terms of what we believe that you can make per day.

Garrett: That’s awesome, that’s kind of like the model of the Zillow or Redfin, you know, what your house is worth and it’s a good kind of content marketing angle.

Adam: Oh, it’s, it’s wonderful. I mean it, this is a question that we got for years and years and years and we didn’t really have a great answer to it and we had, we’ve been working on this product for quite some time. We knew that eventually we were going to have to unveil this data and I’m just happy it’s out there in the wild because now when friends say, “Hey, I’m thinking about listing a car on Turo” instead of me having to grasp at straws, I can just say, just use the tool.

Garrett: That’s awesome. Cool and what are some other, I guess, what are some lower funnel KPIs you guys optimize towards?

Adam:So for us it’s really about whether or not you complete your listing on Turo,  and then how exactly you progress through that funnel. So on the supply side, if you think about somebody who’s coming in listing their vehicle for the first time, they have a lot of questions, right? They’re wondering what the service is about and they’re really trying to learn it as they go. And so as they go through the funnel, once they list their car, that’s sort of the moment of truth, right? Because when they list it and it’s available in the marketplace for the very first time, they’re going to start getting requests, right? And it’s really up to us to make sure that they are well educated, to be able to accept those requests. One of the lower funnel KPIs that I don’t think a lot of people think about is really what’s the customer experience after they’ve completed their trip, that’s something that we give an awful lot of thought to. We want five star experiences, right? And we want these people to walk away feeling like this was simple, it was convenient, I didn’t have to jump through hoops to do it, it was way easier than a rental car agency, and I got the car I wanted at a great price and I also got to meet this really cool person who owns this vehicle. Sometimes there are some amazing stories that actually go along with these, with these trips. A lot of the times like classic car aficionados even car buffs, like they typically will bond over this experience and they find these other people are out there, that they can drive these cars that otherwise were off limits to them. So I would say ultimately in the, again, this seems like a very odd lower KPI, but we tend to focus on five star trip experiences.

Garrett: That makes sense. 

Casey: Is there any tools that you use to help track the funnel process of the users and where they might drop off of?

Adam: Yeah, absolutely like a lot of UA Professionals, I mean we, we use AppsFLyer, that’s our MMP of choice. We tend to use their API data. It’s fantastic. It’s fast. We also use Google analytics religiously between those two I would say we have sort of both sides of the house covered.

Garrett: Got it and for GA, do you guys do use like UTM kind of a source links just to know where traffic comes from?

Adam: Yeah, absolutely. So we, again, we use UTMs religiously.  What we also do is tend to stitch our web data and our upp data together to get that full picture of attribution.

Garrett: Got It. How do you guys stitch that together?

Adam: So we do look at the signup level. So anytime somebody signs up for Turo all of a sudden we, we essentially have you in our database and then we say, okay, what was that last click,  before they signed up? And that’s, that’s what we are at today, it’s all last click attribution. But ultimately we do want to move to something that’s a little bit more multitouch like, one of the things we’ve noticed is that in order to scale up the business, and I think this goes for almost any business, in order to scale it up, you really have to ask yourself, are my dollars going to the right places? Right? And we’re trying to think a little bit more holistically about our marketing mix and not just what did channel x drive in terms of impact? What did channel y drive in terms of impact? We just can’t scale at just doing that sort of on a one for one level. Also, if you think about incrementality and a much bigger perspective,  you know, our dollars are probably going further than what we’re capturing simply by clicks, right? There’s going to be a certain amount of view through attribution and there’s a certain amount of incrementality that we believe that we’re driving above and beyond this right? And there’s a series of tests that we’re currently running to actually prove that. So I think we’d like to move to something that’s a little bit more multitouch in the future to take advantage of that incrementality.

Garrett: Got It 

Casey: And how has social proven for you, has it changed over the last couple of years with how you’re executing it now?

Adam: Yes, social,  it hasn’t changed tremendously, I would say just from an ad buying perspective, but it  certainly the landscape has changed quite a bit, you know, we didn’t even have snapchat a few years ago and now snapchat is something that we do take advantage of. Even Twitter’s tool set has changed pretty tremendously. If you think about the landscaping for Facebook and Instagram, I mean, Instagram was nascent even a few years ago and now in some regards it’s getting bigger than Facebook right? And I expect that to continue to change.  You know, Facebook obviously has Whatsapp at their disposal, they have Messenger at their disposal. so the real question is how much further can we push it? And I usually think a lot further than where we currently are.

Casey: Okay and then has that involved influencers or just kind of paid media on social platforms?

Adam: Yeah, we’re starting to talk to influencers as well. So a couple of notable examples last year we worked with the comedian Hannibal Buress to produce a series of web videos. He’s, he’s hilarious and if you were able to catch that campaign, it was, it was a blast just to make, I know our team was really, really thrilled with the end result. We also worked with the guys from Super Troopers almost a year ago for Super Troopers 2, amazing meeting those guys. You know, again, I, I consider myself a sort of dyed in the wool Super Troopers fan. So just to be able to meet those guys and make another video with them. Again, that was another really cool web campaign, and then probably our biggest one to date was at the end of last year. We worked with, I guess I’ll call him an influencer that wasn’t an influencer and that was Bumblebee. So we actually went out and produced

Casey: From Transformers?

Adam: We produced a TV spot starring Bumblebee from Transformers it was wonderful. If you go to our YouTube channel now you can find that video. It again a tremendous effort from our brand team.  We put that out as our TV spot over the holidays, again. So influencers to answer your question are becoming a bigger and bigger part of our, of our marketing mix if you will and, without giving too much away, all I’ll say is that we are going to probably surprising people this year as well.

Garrett: Nice cool 

C: I got one more question on this. On the influencer side is and I think everyone’s probably asking the same question, is attribution, how does attribution work or how do you think about it with influencers?

Adam: Yeah with influencers I would say it’s a, it’s a little trickier, right? It becomes somewhat nebulous because they’re creating this sphere of influence that isn’t necessarily captured by click. Another reason why I think it makes sense to move this more incrementality based model over time. So that way we are capturing the, some of the value that we’re creating from all of our channels. One of the ways that we’re looking at it is certainly promo codes I think that’s one way, referral codes, that’s another. But also just making sure that we’re, we’re embedding links whenever these influencers do push out a program. So imagine an influencer who creates a, an Instagram post for us. Right? And let’s say they use Instagram stories, we can have them swipe up and open a link that would drive to install the Turo app. Right? And that is something that I think we’re going to start experimenting with a lot more in 2019.

Garrett: Got it. Okay. And I guess as for other analog channels, how of other analog channels like radio and TV and out of home work for you guys?

Adam: Yeah, so,  there’s some data out there and I think I’ll be presenting even more in the near future,  about our successes with TV. So TV has been, has been a huge growth driver for us. It’s increased several multiples year over year.  We do run national TV, even though we’re not available in the state of New York. That is all disclaimed in the TV spot by the way. But TV has been, again, a huge boon for us and we tend to focus more on the, I guess we call it like the performance side or the remnant side of TV, but also with respect to our demo,  seeing a lot of, engagement with sports programming especially. And now we’re trying to actually move from just remnant TV over into, over the top advertising. So if you think about where things are going, you know, eventually everybody will probably just stream whatever TV, quote unquote content that we want, and it won’t really be traditional linear TV the way that we’ve always thought about it.  We are seeing success though with OTT so far, and you know, that whole sphere is just so massive and it’s really just about how you’re buying and what you’re buying and not necessarily just that you’re doing this big brand TV. Because whenever you say TV, people tend to think about spending millions of dollars on a spot. “Oh, I have to go out and I have to do up fronts”. You know, like an agency. “I have to commit to tens of millions of dollars”. We found a very smart, incremental way to go about driving CPI performance with TV.

Garrett: Wow, Yeah. There’s, there’s actually a lot of kind of, you know, streaming TV platforms out there like Zumo and Pluto, obviously Hulu, ESPN plus,  you know, these play places like that, YouTube TV. So, I guess, how do you guys do tracking, like what type of attribution or data are these streaming platforms able to provide you with so that you know that the user actually installed the app?

Adam: Yeah, that’s a great question. So on the TV side, we’re typically looking at spike analysis. I think that’s why a lot of advertisers do it. So I can’t say we’re doing anything that’s mind blowing in that regard. You know, you run a spot, you see this massive spike because you ran the spot and then all of a sudden you look at the, at the post drag factor, right? And then typically we attribute some sort of future lift to that, I won’t bore you with the details of that. But for more like web enabled programming from like over the top, you do get a one-to-one read and there is no future drag factor because it’s one to one. We already know exactly who’s coming through that spot. So we are looking at web platforms especially. So Pluto TV is one, one partner of ours. We’ve also tested with a number of other platforms, but we’re seeing clicks, we’re seeing views within minutes after that spot runs.

Casey: And are you selecting which audience you can,  choose from those platforms, or is it kind of just like a random network on streaming?

Adam: Right now it’s a little bit more general. The biggest reason why we’re, why we’re going broad instead of so specific is, we don’t know what we don’t know. Right? So I think we’re going to go broader and see what each platform kind of brings. And then once we sort of hone in on an audience and once we see where that response is coming from, then we can really dive a lot deeper.

Garrett: Got it, and when it comes to like press, is that under your team or do you have like a marketing kind of press marketing team that handles that?

Adam: So, we have a great press and PR team and I will let, I will defer to them for all those questions.

Garrett: Cool. Have you guys tried podcast advertising?

Adam: We have in fact, we’re in market right now with several podcasts. A lot of big podcasts actually.  It’s been a lot of fun to work on that project and really it’s gotten a lot of reach and the only reason I know that is because I have people in our office who are coming up to me going, “I didn’t know we were on that podcast” and so, you know, “yeah, I didn’t tell you in advance, but the fact that you’re coming to me and saying that you heard Turo on a podcast”

Garrett: It is really cool.

Adam: It’s very telling. Yeah, we’re, we’re testing podcasts as well and we’ve had some good success in the past. Going back to our relationship with Hannibal Buress. We sponsored his podcast once upon a time and it was, it was fantastic.  I paid for an ad and we got a one minute theme song thanks to him and Tony Trimm from the Handsome Rambler podcast. I totally encourage everyone to check it out as well as this podcast, obviously.

Garrett: Awesome and what about, I guess for podcasts, how do you guys approach attribution? Is it really just referral codes, or are there other ways that you can track effectiveness of the podcast?

Adam: Yeah, I think one of the things that we are starting to look at, especially as we run more of these,  let’s call them more probabilistic channels and less deterministic channels, spikes and brand search. So immediately whenever you start running TV radio if you go out and you, you have a big out of home campaign or you run a ton of podcast volume, we are noticing these very natural spikes and brand volume. A lot of people are searching for Turo that weren’t previously. And we’ve already seen that impact from the podcast side. We’re also trying to couple that with more promo codes, more lengths, vanity URLs, things like that, as well as exit surveys. So think about whenever you come to turo.com and you sign up for the first time as you’re sort of exiting that experience, there’s a survey that will spawn and asked how did you hear about Turo? So, again, we’re marrying a couple of different data points here, but it does give us a more holistic view of what’s working.

Garrett:Awesome. 

Casey: So I’m curious for some of the users out there who might be interested in actually saying up a UA team, how would you go about setting up your team? How do you dissect different roles?  Partition out, you know work, you know, versus like is it, you know, someone’s very focused on paid, someone’s very focused on maybe app store optimization and search, things like that. Can you kind of dive into a little bit how you set up your team and how many people are in your team and how it works?

Adam: Yeah, that’s, that’s another very good question. So there, there’s only three of us today. In the three of us, we have a lot of throughput, that said we have an immense amount of support from the rest of the organization. So I can’t say it’s only three of us. So the first thing I’d recommend is make sure you have some sort of engineering support. I think that’s, that’s the best way to really scale your UA efforts long term. You’re going to want to use a lot of APIs. You’re going to want to be able to import data, export data, and having even a modicum of engineering support is going to go so far. So whether that’s an engineer that sits on a UA team or whether that’s an external engineering team that you liaise with I would definitely recommend having some sort of engineering support. Today at Turo, our acquisition team does liaise with an external engineering team. They sit under the engineering org, and they are immensely helpful. They really do power our UA efforts, in terms of division of responsibilities on our team,  we have one person who’s mostly focused on paid social today, as well as a couple of other channels, mostly on the display side. And then we have one person who’s focused more on the OTA and search channels and this is my shameless plug. We are, we are hiring, we’re always hiring, but I just put out a request for my team for somebody who’s going to be on the SEO conversion rate optimization side of things.

Garrett: Okay, cool. And I guess when it comes to, what are your thoughts on using Programmatic to drive performance or mobile app installs?

Adam: I think there’s definitely a place in our portfolio for Programmatic. Programmatic is interesting because there, there’s a couple of companies out there that are doing it really, really well the one that comes to mind aside from Thalamus,  is The Trade Desk. They’ve forged this incredible relationship with agencies and clients alike, but really the promise that is Programmatic, I think it’s there, it’s just a matter of how exactly you harness it. So the most immediate way that I tend to think about it is retargeting or if you have third party, or first party data that you can bring to that party that’s when, to me it gets super, super powerful because suddenly you’re not out there prospecting ad nauseam, but you’re starting to get a little bit deeper in terms of who your audience is what they might look like. I also think look a likes could be very powerful on programmatic. But it’s really a reach extension, right? There’s only so much reach you’re going to get bouncing around sort of the, the walled gardens, if you will.

Casey:So have you seen a lot of success in retargeting campaigns?

Adam: So retargeting is something that we were continuing to dabble in.

Casey: It’s just like a passive thing maybe?

Adam: I wouldn’t say it’s a passive thing. I think for us, we’re, we’re constantly trying to get better at it and deeper at it. So if you think about somebody who let’s say comes to turo.com and then they leave, like, sure, we can retarget them with a very vanilla ad, but the more and more that they give us a as a user, the better we can make that experience. So think about that juxtapose against somebody who installs the Turo app, searchers for Los Angeles within a given date range three or four times. We can retarget you with a list of vehicles in Los Angeles that fit your criteria, right? So there’s a vanilla experience, but then there’s the very detailed experience. We want to do more of the latter and less of the former.

Garrett: So are you guys using like a Criteo to pass data to them so that you actually, you know, they can serve ads depending on what the user looked at.

Adam: I won’t reveal who exactly we’re using, but sort of along those lines right? So really operationalizing our vehicle selection and I mean we have over 800 makes and models. So that’s the kind of thing that we want to leverage in our advertising.

Casey: And what about all the different creatives? So do you have,  is it that the same service that you’re using also kind of dynamically generates the creatives or do you guys have to manually create like 800 different creatives on LA and the SUV or something like that?

Adam: Oh, no, but by the time you’re at our scale, hopefully you’re not doing anything manually. This is, this is where the engineering team comes in. Again, like I can’t thank them enough for some of the work that they do behind the scenes, but that’s where you’re really gonna want to get those API’s ready and be able to pipe them into some sort of, you know, a DMP or pipe them into some sort of DSP so that way you can operationalize it.

Casey: Okay. So that kind of brings me to the next question, is some of the tools that you’re using to help operational workflow. So maybe like dynamic creatives or you mentioned your use Appsflyer as your attribution partner.  Maybe you could just like list down a couple of your favorite tools that use to help you guys.

Adam: Sure. So I’ll talk about our shiny new toy which is Smartly, so Smartly kind of blew me away whenever we first started using it,  it’s, it’s a fantastic FMP for those who don’t know. It seemed like every so many years we’d go through this process where we kind of audit all the FMPS, we’d kind of test drive a few of them. But Smartly seems like a great option. I mean, we’re using some of their dynamic creative tools to your question.  And also some of their advanced tool sets that just aren’t available via Facebook. So again I almost see a future of paid social where things are a little bit more automated and a little bit more tailored to whatever that users are already experienced and whatever touchpoints they’ve already had with the product.

Garrett: Okay. Nice. And what about like, you know, the industry deals with a lot of issues like attribution, fraud and click spamming. How do, how do you go about kind of identifying the partners that are doing these types of tactics and like what are some, what are some ways in which you’re able to identify partners that are using some of these methods?

Adam: Yeah, for us, we definitely put the onus on some of the partners that we’re using. So to go back to the toolsets question AppsFlyer has done a tremendous job, I would say, and weeding out fraud and that, that is honestly one of the reasons why we use them. So as we scale up the business, as we start to use a few, a few additional partners and we add those back into our marketing mix there’s really no concern that fraud is going to creep into our UA efforts.  That said, we definitely approach everything very carefully and very pragmatically just for that reason. Programmatic we, you know, we haven’t gotten super big with it just yet. Just because we are concerned about fraud and it’s something that we’re always watching for.

Garrett: Got it, are there any untapped sources or kind of opportunities that you guys are thinking about testing that you can share for 2019, 2020, Q two, Q three.

Adam: Just wait until I can you know, I can strap a VR headset to you and all of a sudden you’re going to take the best virtual trip ever. No, I mean, truth be told there, there were always things that we’re thinking about and always things that we’re considering.  I think the things that we tend to focus on really have to be scalable, right? I would say at our size, we want to make sure that there’s, you know, there was a time, I should say, in the, in the company’s history when I was happy to reach a few hundred people or even a few thousand people. Now, if we’re not reaching millions of people we’re probably doing it wrong. You know that’s really the one thing I tend to keep in mind. And there’s really only a handful of platforms out there that are really as scalable as paid social, as search, as TV.  And we tend to focus on those. One of the things my team is probably getting so sick of me saying but I think it holds true is we really want to go deep on these scalable platforms before necessarily go wider because there’s so much reach when you think about the fact that Facebook’s portfolio of companies reaches 2.9 billion people around the world, that’s a significant percentage of the world’s population. I mean so we really can do a lot in there before we necessarily have to go searching for other channels.

Garrett: Got It. And what if you can share what percentage of your ad spend goes to like major platforms like Google and Facebook as compared to independent networks?

Adam: Yeah, I would say a lot of it does you know what the exact percentages off the top of my head, I wouldn’t even know,  even if I wanted to tell you but you know, the truth is we are trying to build this mid tail and sort of long tail of other channels.  You know, we always expect there to be a consistent stream of business going to those platforms but there are a lot of other great platforms out there like some of OTA channels, like some other travel partners, like our affiliate marketing like a lot of other business development and partnership deals that we think can be very creative and very profitable for the business.

Garrett:Got It. Cool 

Casey: Are some of these travel partners, do they operate on like a CPA or is it CPM basis?

Adam: It really depends on the partner.  You know, it really depends exactly how you want to structure that deal.

Garrett: Awesome. So I guess we’re, I think we’re out of time today, so thanks again, Adam for coming on the podcast and,  hopefully we’ll see you again soon.

Casey: Thanks again, Adam.

Adam: Yeah, my pleasure. Thank you so much.