In this episode of the Impostor Syndrome Files, we talk about success, including how we define it and whether that definition actually works for us. My guest, Jean Tien, intuitive mindset coach, author and podcast host, shares her S.U.C.C.E.S.S. method, which is designed to help us define and achieve success on our own terms, rather than in ways that are influenced by external pressures. We also talk about changes that need to happen in the workplace to make it easier for all of us to pursue our own definitions of success.
About My Guest
As the first-born daughter of Asian immigrants, Jean followed her parents’ formula for success. They pushed her in her studies so that she could graduate from an Ivy League university and work in a corporate setting that would provide a nice paycheck. Even though her corporate career flourished with 2 promotions in 2 consecutive years and a 6 figure income jump in only 3 years, she continued to fumble through life until she finally realized that “happily ever after” doesn’t automatically happen when you start to make more money or climb the corporate ladder. She says that following this age-old formula for success, I wasn’t allowing myself to be ME.
With over 20 years of experience, Jean knows what it’s like to juggle a successful career with being a mom yet still feels like she hasn’t gotten anywhere. No matter how hard she worked to achieve more in life, Jean knew that she couldn’t reach it if she kept pushing herself to conform to the expected definition of success. This is what motivated her to create the S.U.C.C.E.S.S Method for ambitious women to achieve the success they never thought possible.
Jean is also a podcast host. Her podcast, Being Unapologetically Authentically, has been featured in Armstrong Wolfe, the Financial Advisory Firm for the COO. She’s also been a guest on a number of podcasts, as well as featured in magazines, such as the Authority Magazine, an online publication devoted to sharing in-depth, and interesting interviews, featuring people who are authorities in Business, Pop Culture, Wellness, Social Impact, and Tech.
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Connect with Jean Tien:
Website: https://jeantien.com/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/jeanftien
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/jeantien/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jean-tien/
Twitter: https://twitter.com/jeantien
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Websites:
https://yourcareersuccess.com | https://impostorsyndromefiles.com
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Transcript:
Kim Meninger
Welcome, Jean, it is so great to meet you today. I’m excited for this conversation. And before we jump in, I’d love to invite you to introduce yourself.
Jean Tien
Thanks, Kim, I’m so excited to be here on the show. Thank you so much for having me. My name is Jean Tien. And I am the creator of the S.U.C.C.E.S.S. method, which is a proprietary method that I’ve come up with, to help ambitious women really uplevel their success without having to sacrifice the things that they love, which I think is one of the biggest misconceptions or myths out there that we’ve been told, I guess it’s a nice way of saying it, all of our lives. And so I am so excited to be on the show to be able to share that with your audience today as well.
Kim Meninger
I can’t wait to hear more about it. I want to start by asking you what got you to this point. Do you experience particular challenges yourself? Or what were you seeing in the world that led you to think I need to do something to fix this?
Jean Tien
Oh, yeah, I was definitely experiencing it. So I guess I’ll start going all the way back. I am the daughter of immigrant parents. And so with the immigrant story, it’s not really unique, right? We come we really work hard, we focus on education, that’s always what my parents had emphasized. And then there’s this belief that if you put your work if you put your head down and work hard, then that equals success, you’ll climb the corporate ladder, and eventually, you’ll get to the top. What I realized, though, was that you can put your head down and work hard, but there’s a lot of in-betweens that happen that may not necessarily help you along the way in terms of achieving the goals that you want from your career. And it stalled me in very serious ways, in the sense that I never felt like I belonged in corporate, I always felt like the ugly duckling in corporate. And it wasn’t until I figured out how to a quote, I’ll put it in quotes because I don’t believe in this word that well, that much, but how to fit in, into corporate did I start to realize and see the success that I was looking for all of my life. And so and it didn’t. And it came with a much more fulfilling feeling rather than this constant chasing of something that seemed really far away, or really far out of reach. And so that is what motivated me to create the success method because I feel like we operate under this paradigm of hard work equals success. And I think that gets us to a certain place in our lives. But then there’s this shift that then has to happen. And not too many people talk about it, people aren’t sharing about it, right? And so it’s a huge disservice to folks like yourself and myself, who are ambitious, who want to have it all, but then are told that we can’t and I don’t believe in that either. So yeah, so I want people to feel ease as they’re going through life and being able to achieve the success that they want.
Kim Meninger
Wow, that’s, that’s amazing. And now I can’t wait to hear what is it.
Jean Tien
So it is a seven-step process. And so and it’s super easy, because well, it’s not super easy, but it’s super easy to remember. Because each it’s an acronym, I guess is each letter of success stands for the action that has to be taken in order to be clear about the success that the person or you want. And then to create the action plan to get to where you want to go. So for example, S is to suss out your definition of success. And it sounds so basic. And you know, I think most of your listeners would be there and say like, Well, Doug, of course, you have to know what your success means in order to, you know, to have success. But I can tell you the number of people that I’ve actually asked, what is success mean to them? They have not had an answer that they felt confident about, that they felt comfortable with saying out loud. And most of the times, they’re just going by what they’ve been told success should mean for them. And so the sussing out part is so key, because if we can’t get clear on what success means for us, we’re doing a lot of busy work chasing something that we don’t necessarily feel energized by or believe in. And then the U stands for underlying and underscoring all of the success that we have already achieved. Because once we clear out what it means for us, we can take a look back and say, wow, look, we’ve achieved all this, all of these things already. And most of us because we’re so ambitious, and because we’re women, we tend to just say, well, these are the things we should do. Who says we should do any of them, right? These are the things we have done and we need to celebrate ourselves for having done all of them. because it could have just been used as easy for us not to have done it. But we made the choices to do them. And we need to celebrate them. Because once we start to celebrate them, we start to shift the way we see ourselves, we start to grow in confidence, we start to grow. And I know some people don’t like this word, but we start to grow in our resilience. And we start to see things as possible that things may not have seen possible in the past.
Kim Meninger
Can I stop you right there first? Yeah, I want to really emphasize what you’re saying. I wholeheartedly agree, I think just to speak to the SME you so far, that point you made about really needing to understand your own definition of success, as opposed to one that’s been imposed upon you, or some kind of ambiguous force that’s driving you in this direction is so so critical, because, yeah, never if you’re trying to achieve a definition of success, that’s not your own, you’re never going to feel satisfied, you’re never going to feel like you’ve gotten there. And that’s so I think, so much a part of so many of our stories is we feel like we have to do what we’ve been told as opposed to, to coming up with that on our own. And, and I love what you’re saying about recognizing our successes, because I’ve talked about this before in other settings that our brains are naturally wired to think about the pot, that negative will always go to the, you know, if you get a 98% on your test, you’re going to focus on the 2%, you got wrong, knew and did well. And so to have a practice for connecting with what’s going well, absolutely makes a difference when you in how you see yourself, how confident you feel. So this is great. Thank you.
Jean Tien
Yeah, absolutely. I’m so glad you resonate with it, too. And you know, it’s so interesting, because the example you gave that 90%, I think so many of us can resonate with it, especially for those of us that are ambitious and have a goal in mind, right? Because we’re and I call it the 1% 1% zone. So we always focus on the 1% that we missed, instead of the 99% that we get wrong. And if you take a step back, you’re just like, why would we do something like that, but like you said, our brains are just naturally geared into that 1%. So whether it’s biologically entrained, in us for survival purposes, whatever the case is, that’s where our brains are sitting that 1%. So it’s so important to shift it to that 99%. And it’s not hard to get to that 99%, and so on. Because it’s 99% of everything that we’ve done, right? Like, you’ve like tiptoe into that zone, and you’re gonna find something to be like celebratory about. So then the next C is basically to check to see. So once we have this success definition, once we have an underlying or underscored all the success that we’ve achieved, now we’re going to check to see if the goals that we haven’t achieved yet are still aligned with us, we still resonate with them, if they still energize us, right? Because so often, we can go by goals, and we have them in our head for whatever reason, and we never reevaluate them as we grow. It’s kind of like you’re trying to fit into the size two jeans, if you’ve already outgrown the size, two jeans, right, you’re like trying to fit into it. And you we know all know how uncomfortable that could be. And we’re beating ourselves up for not fitting into something that doesn’t suit us anymore. And so once we’ve checked, whether or not the goals that we haven’t achieved, yet align with us, we cross out all the ones that don’t resonate with us. And now that makes room for goals that we can then choose, that will energize us that are resonating with us for today. And we don’t have to worry about tomorrow, we just worry about today. And because then these goals, and we create these goals that align with us. And when our confidence grows, when we are more energized by them, we innately and inherently will create goals that are bigger than what we’ve ever expected or ever thought we could admit out loud, right? And that could potentially bring a bit of fear on and so the E is to energetically release these fears, through our thoughts through our beliefs, journaling them out. And then so then we can get rid of the fear so that we can continue to move along. And the last two s’s are really about staying in the excitement and then staying in the self-care. Because you can’t like we all are human. I don’t believe in the hustle culture. To be honest. I think it really does us a disservice. And so if we can stay in the energy of excitement. We can continue it’s like fuel. It’s like gas, we continue to stay gassed up, right? And the self-care is so important for us to be able to do that. Because if you’re running on empty, doesn’t matter how much you believe in your goals. One little mishap could seriously overthrow all of the progress that you’ve made and throw you totally off your game. And then it’ll take you even longer to get back on track. And so those are like the seven steps of the success method. So easy enough, but you know, it’s in the application.
Kim Meninger
Absolutely. But I love the simplicity of the model because everything that you said is so intuitive. It’s not something that we often think about, right? I think that that is the nature of the work that you and I both do, or it’s not rocket science, but it’s hard to prioritize, it’s hard to create the space for it. And so to have a methodology that you could follow just breaks it down to, you know, a structure that’s more likely for us to follow through on.
Jean Tien
Yeah, and I’m glad you said that, because that’s exactly what it is. It’s like, oh, wait, I want success. How do I get it? And then you go through it, you can’t forget it. Right?
Kim Meninger
That’s right. How did you? So you’re in this world, right? You described your own experience. How did you get from where you were, to developing this methodology? Where did you how did you figure this out?
Jean Tien
Oh, yeah. So I never thought I would be doing any of this, I thought my life would be a very traditional path into very comfortable living, right? That’s what our goal was. But then, when I was about 40 years old, so about five years ago, I just felt miserable on the inside. And it didn’t matter what I was going through at work, it actually worked exacerbated the situation, right? But I would wake up every morning, my husband would drive me to work. And I was like, literally crying on the inside and crying on the way to work crying at work crying from work. And it just, I was so unhappy. I didn’t, I couldn’t imagine living my life with this hamster wheel nine to five. And what made it really bad for me was I knew I was capable of doing so much more. And everything I was doing felt very trivial, right? But it made such a huge difference in my life, even though I knew it didn’t matter in the grand scheme of things. And so I thought I was broken, I literally looked around, everybody was so happy. And that’s why I said, I thought I was the misfit in corporate because everybody looks so happy. And I felt so miserable. And so I wanted to go out and look to find the answer to look for what was missing. And everything felt as if it was so far away that I couldn’t achieve it. So I knew I needed to do something different. So I started down this path of personal development. And that led me into kind of understanding what drives me and the impact that I can have. And when I started working with clients, I loved it. Like it was like, Oh, my God, I want more of this, right? And, you know, what it showed me and what it reminded me was, everything I’ve ever done was always to try and help people. So even in corporate the job that I took, the way I view it, it was always, this is how I can help people. And that’s always been key in terms of my success at work once I figure that out, right? But even before corporate, I wanted to be like pre-med, so I want it to take care of people. And so when I found coaching, it was like, Oh, I can finally do this without going through med school without you know, like all these other things, right? And instead of like when you’re incorporate helping people, you don’t necessarily see the impact right away. But when you’re working one on one, you see the impact, like immediately you see the light bulbs go off. And so that just made the decision easy in terms of what I wanted to do. And when I started working with people, I realized I wasn’t alone, there are so many people that just faked it better than I could. I couldn’t fake it. And so when they would come to me, and we would go through these things, and I started asking them this set of questions, and they were so lost. I was like, Wait, there’s something here. And it’s important to start to share it with everybody. And this is why it’s so important from an authenticity perspective, too. Because when we’re not, what I realize is that when we’re not authentic, and we’re trying to fit into this person that we think we have to be, we become all sorts of like tense and frustrated and critical and judgmental of both ourselves and of others as well. And it just makes it very uncomfortable.
Kim Meninger
And I’m glad you said that too. I have so many thoughts in response to everything that you’ve said, I see a lot of myself in the story that you share too about wanting to help people and finding, finding that opportunity through coaching and I think, you know, it really, it really sort of stuck out to me that you were in this moment of crisis when you finally came to this decision. And I’ve heard that so often It almost it takes really an eye. This sounds so cliche, but almost like reaching your rock bottom in your career in order to start to really think about some of these themes that we’re talking about today. And I really wish for everybody listening, that we could find a way to not let it get to that point, right, because what you’re talking about in terms of how we show up for ourselves and others when we find ourselves in that space, is we’re irritable, we’re not feeling good about ourselves. And that has a contagious effect on the people around us, too, we may not realize it, but through our body language, through the way we communicate, we are also spreading that energy to people around us. And so it’s no surprise that so many people are struggling in their work environments with lack of psychological safety and all kinds of toxic behaviors and cultures because people don’t have coping mechanisms for the kinds of struggles that we’re talking about. And so I just think if we could look at this as more of a preventive measure, as opposed to something that it’s like a treatment when you’ve gotten to the point where all else has failed, we would all be in such a better place.
Jean Tien
Yeah, yeah. And I think corporate is such a good microcosm of real life, right? Because if you look at it, we’re just in a smaller container. But everybody in corporate, and I will say, everybody, I’ll bet my like, house on it, maybe not. But I don’t know if my husband would like that, but, but I will bet a lot, that the people that we meet in corporate, all have some growth that’s required, in order for corporate to be the place where I think we’re all trying to get to through ESG, through, you know, ERGs, through mental health awareness, like, you know, we’re all trying to get to that place. And we’re all fixing it at the very surface level. But the difference in terms of the work that I do to with my clients, because, you know, they come to me, and they’re frustrated with something or another at work, but we don’t look at that, we look at what’s going on with them. Because when you can fix with what’s going on with them, the outer stuff just kind of takes care of its own. Not that like, you know, if Pam was very mean to meet, you know, the, my client, not that, like Pam would stop being mean all of a sudden, but my client would stop caring, right? Because it wouldn’t trigger her as much. And then she can then move past that. So it’s like one lesson after another that comes through. And it will change the experiences that people have, to a point where like, it’s not that big of a deal, or if it is, and it comes through the recovery time. And this is where the resilience comes in, is like five minutes instead of five days or five months, right? Or five years, even that we hold on to things. And I think that just changes the way that we can experience life and makes it a lot more, makes it a lot more open and possible for us to actually be present rather than worrying about Oh, my God, what about tomorrow? And I have to make this and, and what did they say this? Or how could she say that? You know, and all the things in the past, right? Because then we were like, It’s okay.
Kim Meninger
You’re so right. And I think that that’s one of the things that I think about a lot two is that, because we’re such egocentric beings, we make everything about ourselves. And that’s not a criticism. It’s just a reality. So we’re all coming into these environments. And we’re personalizing and reading into and trying to make sense of everything that we’re experiencing around us. And we’re getting triggered over and over and over again, at the same time that we’re triggering other people. And I think just that awareness that how other people are showing up 99% of the time has nothing to do with you. It’s about them and their issues and their stuff that they’re not dealing with. And so arming people individually with the skills to be able to create that distance to be able to create that resilience is so important. And at the end of the day, going back to where we started with the definition of success. If it’s an environment that repeatedly puts you in a position where you have to do that, then then it’s worth considering whether this is a place where you can be your best self and do your best work because, because what I one of the messages that I repeatedly try to convey is that even if it doesn’t feel like it you always have choices. You don’t have to stay it may not be easy, but you don’t have to stay in an environment that consistently makes you feel that way.
Jean Tien
Yep, no, I totally, totally agree. And it’s scary though when you think about change, especially if you’ve been in In a place, you know, for more than a couple of years, it’s scary to change. But I agree with you 100%. It’s our choice we have to choose, are we comfortable? Or we’re gonna stay with the comfort and the discomfort of you know, in the comfort of the discomfort? Or are we going to go and try something new and maybe be a little bit uncomfortable there as well? But there’s other possibilities there as well, too, right? So it’s everybody’s choice. I agree.
Kim Meninger
And I’m curious, if you, if you spend time thinking about because I love the self-empowerment aspect to your model, I also wonder if you have thoughts on how to bring other people into the journey with you because it’s really hard to create change in a vacuum. So if I redefine my own vision of success, and I decide I’m going to make some adjustments to my behaviors, like, I’m going to set boundaries, I’m no longer going to do these things that aren’t serving me or that are kind of undermining my ability to achieve my goals. Eventually, people are going to start to say, Huh, what’s up with her? She’s acting differently. And so I wonder if you have thoughts on? How do you have that conversation? Or how do you navigate the external world while you’re doing all of this internal work?
Jean Tien
That’s a really great question. So I think, number one, it’s so important to have somebody there to support you and to guide you and to continue to support your decisions, right, not what they think is right for you. But your decisions. And I think this is where and I think Kim and you know, you’ll probably agree with me, this is where coaching really comes in. And is really helpful, because as coaches, we don’t push them to what we want them to do. We support them in the ways that they need us to support them and help them in terms of their choices, etc. But I also think that, you know, if there are situations that are out there in their external world, or quote unquote, real world and they can’t get past it, it’s important to look, you know, I also think it’s still important to look at why. Right, and but then if not, you know, I think the, the difference, though, is not go out and ask everybody for the answers. Why, because everybody will have a different interpretation of the same fact pattern. But it’s to look at what we believe in. And then also maybe even have a conversation with the other person. And I’m gonna say this with an asterisk because it’s to have a conversation. But without expectations, because oftentimes, like let’s say, for example, you and I have a disagreement or a conflict, somehow, I can come to you in good intent, and with good heart and say, Kim, you know, I’d really love to talk about what happened the other day, but the other person may not be willing to have an open conversation, they may not be in a place where they can get vulnerable with it. And so the conversation could just be very much a one-sided, and the result may not be what you’re expecting for or may expecting to receive from it, right? And I think those conversations, even though they don’t go the way that you want them to go, I think they’re still helpful. Because and then in the sense that you’ve set out in a night, an intention, that was good, you know, and I’ll say good versus bad, but like, you set out an intention for everybody’s highest good to like, kind of resolve the situation, right? Without an expectation of how it should go. If the other person isn’t willing to have it, now you know that the other person isn’t willing to have it. And then you can kind of adjust your behavior based off of it as well, right kind of adjust your assessment of the situation. But also understanding that my or your response to my reach out may not be Pat’s response to my reach out, or John’s response to my reach out, everybody will have something different, and not holding on to what the past is to say like, well, Kim didn’t really respond that well, maybe I shouldn’t have a conversation with John, what if he did the dough? I think it’s important that if something is beneficial to have to talk about to resolve from a conflict perspective, or whatever else, then have the conversation if it’s that important, right? If, if you think that doing so will benefit. The situation will benefit everybody.
Kim Meninger
That’s a really good point. And I think, to your point also about how everyone’s gonna have a different reaction. I recognizing that it’s difficult to separate the emotion from the conversation itself. I do like to think of people’s responses as data, right? So if you look at it, and you get, you know, Pat’s responses, one of maybe resistance or something like that’s interesting data, right? Like, what does that tell me about what he values or what does that tell me about what he is afraid of? Or you know, is that reflective of how other people respond, or is it a one-off and to just kind of try to look at it less from an emotional perspective and more of a curiosity-based perspective, and then it allows you to collect the information that you need in order to make the bigger choices that we’re talking about.
Jean Tien
Yeah, I love that. So true. It’s so true. And it’s just the perspective of like life or death versus trial and error like you’ve said, Right?
Kim Meninger
Exactly. And I also think about, I’m curious what your thoughts are on this. Not everybody is in an environment where it’s safe to do this. But so many of the big themes that we talk about, like burnout, let’s say, or time management, or, you know, work-life integration, or whatever expression we’re using to call that right, right now, right? Our universal themes, we’re all struggling with them, but we don’t necessarily have a place to talk about them as a collective within our work environments. We’re all trying to solve the problem on our own. And I feel like if we can start to bring other people into the conversation, not from the perspective of this is what I need from you. And this is how I’m personally going to be changing my behaviors. But more so to say, let’s acknowledge that we are all struggling with this, right? We all have been given messages about what success is supposed to mean to us. And we probably all have an actual definition that deviates from that. So why don’t we all come together to talk about how we can collectively support one another on this journey? And here’s some tools or here’s some things that we can do to hold each other accountable. Or here’s some ways that we can support each other. So that it feels like we’re all of this together, as opposed to it’s, you know, it’s all about me, and everyone else is gonna be resentful because they’re not able to take advantage of the same kinds of freedom or opportunities that I’m taking advantage of.
Jean Tien
Yeah, I think, ideally, I think that would be amazing. If everybody can come to the table and have a conversation. I think, just kind of thinking it through, though. I think it’s important to also, I don’t know, you know, what, here’s what I’ll say, I think that in this environment we’re in today, it’s important for people to come to the table, just open minded. I think that’s where the key is, right? And I think that it’s important for employers to come to be open to hearing what their employees have to say. And then also for the employees to come in to be unafraid of sharing what their thoughts are. And I don’t know if they’ll ever get to that middle point where everybody is happy, because I don’t think you can make everybody happy. But I think more than making everybody happy and getting your way, I think more people are asking for a yearning to be heard and to be seen. And I think that’s the conversation that will help people get to that next level. Right? Like we’ve gotten to this place where, okay, we recognize that D and I efforts are important. But there’s almost like this level of there’s almost like the next phase that now I think people are asking for, but I don’t know if people know how to come to the table to have that conversation. Right. And there’s a lot of fear that’s going into it because we’re in a canceled culture. We’re in, you know, this, like immediate reaction type of culture. And I think people like I don’t necessarily even feel 100% comfortable all the time to come and share exactly what’s on my mind, because I’m, you know, I don’t think a lot of people would agree with what I have to say all the time. And so, you know, there’s a, there’s a level that’s like, Okay, well, you know, I’ll share what I think people are able to consume at this point. But I think the more open that we are, I think we’ll get to that place faster. And it’ll help more people rather than, you know, I think right now, we’re helping a small group of people that I think will be able to help a bigger group of people, once we’re all kind of coming into this place where the employer knows that their job is not to make everybody happy, but to make do to, to help people feel heard and seen. And for the other side, to come forward and not be afraid to share. I think that’s really where…
Kim Meninger
Yeah, I really like that perspective, because I think we are embarking on this whole new phase of work where it was never even a possibility for most of history to come to your manager and talk about some of the things that we’re talking about these days. So there. There’s a lot that managers haven’t been trained to do in terms of support in these areas. I think those are the keys is the willingness to listen and make people feel heard. It’s just make it safe to have the conversation. And at the end of the day, maybe it’s not the right place for you. Or maybe there are some adjustments that can be made, maybe there’s nothing that needs to change. Other than that you have an opportunity to just share what’s on your mind, but to create the space for those conversations is really important. And my hope is that becomes, you know, a future phase of the DEI process. Right? Yeah. It’s really going deeper.
Jean Tien
Yeah. Yeah. And it’s not just affecting a certain group of employees. I think it’s really affecting all employees, right? Because, you know, dads are, there’s more stay-at-home dads. Now, there are more dads who require different type of accommodations, and especially now post-pandemic, and I say, post-pandemic, because, you know, we’ve passed that critical juncture. But especially now we’re seeing kind of how the family dynamics are changing at home as well, right? And everybody’s realizing that their needs aren’t so easily fit into fitting into that mold anymore, right? There’s different things that are coming up. And so yeah, the conversation is so important. And it’s just, people need to be comfortable with having it and, and I think it’s so important, as I say, this, like the immediate thought, or the immediate thing that came to mind is like people have to be willing to not be on the defensive. Like, that’s really what the key is, right? It’s like, okay, well, you said this, it hurt my feelings. And immediately, it’s like, well, I didn’t mean it. I’m not, did it? You know, like, that’s the type of conversation that people have to be comfortable with having because it’ll happen. But then knowing how to get from there to the end state, or the goal state is, is so critical.
Kim Meninger
Well, I think that’s another great takeaway. So you know, we talked about doing the work that you’re describing, and hopefully doing it before, it’s a crisis situation. So they can, you know, you can, you can prevent that from happening, but also the opportunity for all of us to check ourselves and to stay self-aware enough to recognize where that defensiveness where if some of those assumptions might be getting in our way, when we are interacting with other people around and being responsible for our own emotions, examining it through different lenses. And, you know, I think that if we all collectively commit to doing more of that work, hopefully, we’ll start to see that change in terms of culture, too.
Jean Tien
Yeah, I think so. I think it’ll happen. I’m going to be optimistic about.
Kim Meninger
I know it’s not going to be easy, but I’m definitely hopeful. So where can people find you Jean, if they want to learn more?
Jean Tien
Yeah. So they can find me and I have a website. It’s jeantien.com. But I also have a book that will be coming out, I think, maybe late January, early February. So, so yeah, so it’s called Your Success Blueprint. And there’ll be able to order it online. I think it’ll be on Amazon. And it’ll go through all the steps. It’ll have journal prompts and meditations that they can access to help them with the journal prompts, so that they can really get clear in terms of who and who they are, and what it is that they value from a success perspective.
Kim Meninger
Oh, that’s very exciting. So I will include all of your information in the show notes for anybody to hear more. And thank you so much for this conversation. It was so great to talk to you today.
Jean Tien
Thanks, Kim. It was so fun to be here. Thank you for having me.
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