Former student-athlete that got soft in college and stayed that way post-graduation much to my horror. Now that I've been working for ~2 years FT I've gotten back into shape jumping into combat sports and distance running during this pandemic along with reestablishing a solid routine. I feel like a million bucks and plan to start competing in the former in my free time but I know that I want/need something more meaningful in my life. I come from a military background on my father's side (Marines, Army, and Air Force throughout for the last few generations). A couple years ago I started listening to Tim Kennedy & Jocko Willink talk about their experiences (thanks JRE) and the challenges + opportunities to develop leadership qualities in the Special Forces/Navy Seals sound both honorable and appealing.
For now my plan is to keep working for at least another 1-2 years (have some non-student debts to pay off + helping family + want some work experience pre-military) while I build my strength/endurance beyond the requirements I've read online and continue to thoroughly research both processes. I'm thinking about enlisting and going for OCS by the time I'm 25/26 (24 now) that way when I get out I'll still be young enough to reasonably apply for MBA programs.
Would love to hear from Vets who have gone down either of these tracks and are willing to share their experiences. I'm currently leaning towards Seals because I've always been a water guy (scuba certified, multiple water sports). If you're willing to talk 1-on-1 off of WSO even better, let me buy you a drink and thank you personally for your service.
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Have been really thinking about this a lot over the last year, and ever since my friend joined the USAF, he's been pushing me to join. Being in the SF would be amazing, but if I'm not cut out, spec ops would be cool too. Gotta get in better shape though, which is doable. It would be easy to get a cushy job in finance, but I feel I'll have time for that after serving, the time to join something like the SEALs or SF is more limited. Related to the above should I go enlisted or as an officer?
You can definitely just enlist nothing wrong with that, most of my family were enlisted. I don't see any reason why not to try for officer status if you're willing to put in the extra time + effort though, someone feel free to correct me if there's something I'm not aware of.
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Yeah, but I think if I'm going to do it, I want to do it as an officer. Especially if I can be an officer in the SF, which actually takes some time - you have to be a 1st Lt. or Cpt to be eligible. Hopefully some guys on here can give us more insight.
What do you mean by this? SF is special operations...same with SEALs, Pararescue, MARSOC, etc. No offense, but the "spec ops would be cool too" comment kind of shows you need to do more research. If you don't pass SF selection, you really think you can just hop to the Navy and go to BUD/s? Nope, you're part of Big Army now.
Anyways, everyone commenting needs to really consider if this is something they want to do, for real. If you go to r/navyseals, you'd find better info and responses. But beware, everyone in that sub had a revelation during COVID and now all of a sudden they want to a be a cool guy and do cool guy things.
I meant the rangers if I cant be a green beret. Yeah, you're right I have to do more research.
Commenting because interested as well.
If you're looking at SEALs, look up Stew Smiths bud/s prep workout. Helps many SEAL/SpecOps wannabes.
I also hope you are aware that with each year that goes by, you are doing yourself and your body a disservice. 28 is the SEAL cutoff (29 with waivers, but they ain't giving those out like in 2010). How fit are your shoulders, knees, and neck? What type of running are you doing? I certainly hope not streets or a track. You will be competing against 17-24 year olds - the prime age of new SEALs. Also know that Officer Candidates are expected to lead from the front with everything, so the standards for the enlistees? You need to being doing double or triple.
SEALs/SpecOps community has gotten more competitive than ever. Not only do you just need to "not quit" or be the "gray man", no, you need to put out 110% of the time, especially as an Officer. If the instructor cadre sees an Officer slacking, it's over. I can almost guarantee you would quit by the amount of torture they put you through, mental and physical. Just watch BUD/s Class 234 - nothing really has changed in 20 years.
OCS can be a challenging and grueling process. Sometimes Officer Candidates just enlist because there was too much tape to go around within OCS, just something to watch out for.
Overall, just make sure you are joining for the right reasons. Why do you want to join? Are you trying to be a SEAL to say you are a SEAL? Or do you really want to be outside the wire, risking your life and those of your teammates, for something you may or may not agree with? Have a solid, concrete, unbreakable reason as to why you want to do this. The whole "I'll die before I quit" is extremely prevalent in this community. Otherwise, people quit because their "why" was a bunch of self-obsessive bullshit and that simply won't carry you through Hell Week, let alone 2 years of actual training before you head to a team.
Source - uncle was a snakeater and instructor for 12 years and brother-in-law just got out of Force Recon. If you are actually serious, I can get in touch with them. But do not waste anyone's time if you know deep down this is a fantasy. There is no problem admitting that, I went through the same thing and finally decided it wasn't for me.
OP here. I deliberately waited a couple days to reply to you because you made me think, so I appreciate you've said. I've checked out the Stew Smith BUD/S prep and will be getting it soon, still need to find a pool reasonably close to me where I can practice all of the swim stuff but this looks like a fantastic resource.
I hear you on the aging with each passing year, I can see it in my face and the thinning hairline. I kind of lied in the OP, I turn 24 in
I honestly hate myself for getting soft in school because when I started I was by all accounts a monster, but I view that doughy individual I became as another person at this point since in the last 6 months I'm down ~40lbs and on my way to being utterly shredded by the end of the year. My knees and shoulders are pretty great, though I do have some neck stiffness from a car wreck I got into when I was a teen and am saving up to get an Iron Neck after some recommendations to help with strengthening.
For running I'm putting in ~5-6 miles a day in 85-90+ degree heat while averaging ~8-9 min mile the whole time with one of those altitude training masks, reasonably pacing myself because I'm also grappling 2 hrs a day/5 days a week in separate classes in the early morning/late evening. Once I get Stew's manual I'll definitely work to exceed all the benchmarks by a healthy margin. I like to think I can put in 110% with consistency, if it weren't for my trainers beating the importance of pacing into my head every time we're together I'd be pushing till I puke almost every time I'm getting after it. The sleep deprivation I've seen highlighted is what I imagine would be the hardest part so that'll come down to mental toughness.
I want to join because I love what this country stands for and the vision I have for it, I feel like I'm a hypocrite lying to myself unless do my part to kill enemies whose beliefs I view as so evil they encroach upon that vision and endanger our citizens, and I want to work alongside (and hopefully earn the privilege to lead) people who feel the same. I honestly won't know how strong that conviction truly is until I test it, and I think the biggest indicator will be to see if that conviction feels as strong as it does now after I've spent at least a year working towards and training for the SEAL team. If it's still there when I feel ready I'd love to talk to your uncle. I'm setting this goal somewhat far out because I know I need something to fixate on and work towards, and I can't imagine a more worthy goal at this point in my life. A career sitting on my ass and fiddling with numbers in an office can wait.
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Hey man, you are not the only one who thinks the office life is fucking lame and will still be there 10 years down the line. I respect what you're considering, I just want you to know what you are gonna get into. No one will know what they're made of until they put their moxie to the test, so good on you.
Now, I'm not gonna talk like I train SOF folks or anything, but I do know that 25-29 year olds can and have passed BUD/s before. The younger guys can take more body pain than the older guys, but they lack the maturity/real world skills that someone like yourself would bring. I personally think the best age for BUD/s is 24-26. Perfect amount of real world experience, but still youthful enough to withstand some pretty heavy training for two years. FYI, SF (Green Berets) age limit is 35 or something like that, just something to think about if you delay enlisting with SEALs or decide you want to switch branches.
When it comes to running, again I'm not gonna talk like I train these guys so I'm betting a smart guy like yourself can find some running programs online. Think Stew's workout incorporates some running. Otherwise look up Jake Zweig's youtube running plan he gives someone, think it was pretty legit and seemed difficult. What I do know is that you will want to start running hills and 400m/800m sprints (yes, sprints). The endurance you need to compete at BUD/s is unparalleled.
Which brings me to swimming. Are you a better swimmer or runner? Whatever you are not good at, focus on that. Swimming will boost your endurance and cardio, same way running would, so if you suck at swimming, get on it. Hell, I have heard the INDOC swim training is hard as fuck. So just imagine what BUD/s is gonna be like (if you make it through INDOC) after a 3-mile timed run, then a 500-yard ocean swim with fins - will you be able to complete that in the time allotted? Things to think about while you train. Train smarter, not harder.
All in, just look up former SEAL/SpecOps workouts and you will find a ton. Some are cheap and meant to get a quick buck, but some programs like Stew's and Jeff Nichols' have been tried and true and have helped potential candidates get A SHOT at BUD/s. Know that Olympians, college athletes, professional athletes, all have failed BUD/s. Yet, engineers, math nerds, cross country freaks, gangsters from the Bronx, have all made it. There is no formula to make it. It all comes to down your "why" that I mentioned in my previous post. If you find a concrete reason as to why you want to be there and want to finish, nothing but yourself (or injuries, unfortunately) can stop you.
I've been with you until the paragraph - seems pretty immature. Feel like a hypocrite unless you kill your enemies, lol.
My take based on what you've written is you don't seem to want this for the right reasons. You seem more infatuated with joining special ops than serving under any capacity - thus its more about you than your desire to serve. Also, you're going into it with the goal of still want to do finance on the back end - ie this is just a short stint. I have a lot of friends that have been in special ops across branches, recon, seals, green beret and rangers. None of them speak in the same vein as you do. There might be a lot more to your story but you're definitely coming across as someone that wants to parachute in, do something you perceive as macho due to your own insecurities of having got out of shape (you've referenced this many times), and then drop into a normal life again which you checked it off the bucket list. Not trying to be harsh but I think this is a fair criticism about something that shouldn't be taken so lightly.
I would go to OCS and put in a Ranger Regiment packet(RASP2) after doing your required regular Army time. After doing your minimum time in Regiment, you could decide whether you want to exit to Finance/MBA program (highly recommended), tryout for SFAS/Special Mission Units, or Fed LEO (FBI has some cool gig for ex Infantry/SOF guys).
my nephew is 22, just graduated from military academy and tried out for army ranger school....kid has been an athlete all his life...now in his prime...he missed the cutoff by one pushup within the allotted time (for example, after a 1 mile run with a loaded pack, do 60 pushups in 60 seconds...and he did 59)....the standards are incredibly difficult now